I've been hearing some negative statements concerning nudity in posted art. I'm able to look at any area of the human anatomy and refrain from being offended, or sexually aroused, but it seems that some people have learned an aversion to viewing certain areas of the human body.

My suggestion would be that members could have a way of putting a "Mature Content" on their gallery that contained questionable art work, and if possibly, a sign-in page where the viewer would have to agree that he/she is eighteen or older and that they are not offended by nudity.

These galleries might also have to be linked into a members profile page so that entries would not be displayed in the main gallery page.

These galleries could still be moderated for more obvious pornographic works or extremely offensive work. I'm sure that some people get some perverted pleasure from creating work just for the shock value.

Also, according to the recent poll there seems to be an interest in figure drawing so this concern might worsen if people post more figure drawings.

Bob

It's good that you suggested this Bob.

I had some difficulty when I was doing my figure drawing journal and felt the need to add a "some nudity" warning to the thread title.

On other sites they have a little icon you can post next to the title which acts as a warning.

That said, I don't think Brenda, who is after all the owner of the site, has any objection to nudity as part of art education since she does include full frontal nudity in one of her lessons. It seems to me that people coming here and reading Brenda's lesson should already be aware that there is a possibility of meeting up with drawings of nudes of both sexes. I therefore see no reason why anyone should find this unreasonable or offensive.

Sounds like good logic to me.

Why is this?
I can't understand why we must give a warning if there is a nude figure drawn.
Everywhere we see nude persons - in every journal, newspaper, in TV and so on.

Is this in US different?
Sorry, maybe it is a silly question, but can someone explain it to me? No, I'm not blonde but I never have been in the States.

Martina, I think there are various issues involved. For one thing yes, in Europe society tends to be a little more tolerant of nudity than it is in the US. Go further, into a Muslim country, and it becomes blasphemy. So the first consideration is respect for other cultures.

Another thing one has to keep in mind is that this site is open to everyone, including children. I for one encourage my little grandchildren to visit and view the lessons if nothing else. But you know, once they're in they're in.

Thirdly we must also keep in mind that people may be accessing the site from their workplace where opening a thread and finding nude drawings might place them in an embarrassing situation.

I am not at all against nudity in art, not even on this site, but it is only fair to give due warning so that people know exactly where they stand and the choice whether to view or not remains theirs.

Very well spoken Rose. I don't want to sound as if I am promoting censorship. As I said before, nudity doesn't offend me, but I don't want to risk offending other people who have been taught differently. Because of the Internet the world is swrinking fast.

I was told by Yahoo 360 team to change my setting to 'Adult Content' because I posted the drawing of Botticelli's Birth of Venus and the body building man on my blog. It wasn't much of an inconvience, all it means is kids have to lie to visit my blog now.

I agree ...I have drawn nudes in good taste but maybe it would be wise to mave a mature content warning if it offends people ...maybe Admin can have it posted as you enter the site .

Thank you Rose,

I never thought about this all. I'm not interested in drawing nuditiy, but it doesn't offend me either.

I think it would be a good idea to create a little post-icon or to use one of the existing icons.

Thank you Bob for bringing up this topic! You (and others) have made some excellent points!

We have new members signing up every day from all over the world! I hadn't even thought about cultural sensitivity (shame on me) regarding posting nudes. Please accept my sincere apology if anyone has been offended.

As many of you are aware, our website will be undergoing major upgrades throughout the summer. I will certainly have accommodations made for adult content. However, in the meantime, my wonderful moderators and I will be checking for artworks that cross the line; for example sexually explicit images will be deleted.

Until we get the new forum in place, please be considerate of cultural differences when you post images in the galleries. Also, any member can report any image that creates concern, and the moderators and I will use our discretion as to if it should be deleted.

Brenda

Hi Brenda!
I am totally curious on the new forum. Do you now yet when it will come? I invited a lot people and don't want that they come along and there is nothing but empty space instead of drawspace.



Concerning violence too? Last week I came across a site with some "artwork" with drawings with killed people and animals (the drawings are totally brutal) - I sometimes have the feeling that if someone calls something art it seems that everything is allowed.

Hi Traumsonne,

Thank you for bringing up another good point.

The adult content part of the new site will hold artworks that are deemed inappropriate for children or insensitive to cultural diversity. We have to carefully walk a line so censorship does not become a factor. Many issues, such as violence, will be dealt with once we are up and running!

Drawspace is here to stay! I began this website in 1999 as Fine Art Education, and my old URL's will still bring you here - hoddinott.com and finearteducation.com.

I'm going to be working closely with my wonderful web developers over the next few months. As for when the newly revamped Drawspace will be launched...I really have no timeline yet because we are still planning certain aspects. The new site will not have a different URL. We'll still be Drawspace with a brand new look and lots of additional features.

Brenda

This may be getting off topic a little but I think people need to learn how to "self censor". Once a person reaches a certain age they should be able to refrain from viewing things that offend them without tryint to rid the entire world of all things that offend them. Art is a medium of expression and non-violent even if it contains extremely violent themes.

Just my opinion.

You make a very good point. In our country, we are subjected to all sorts of gratuitous violence in the media and no one seems to care but show an exposed breast and suddenly everyone's in an uproar. Nudity's a part of art and if someone's so offended by it then maybe the world of art isn't for them. When I first read this thread, I had seriously concidered removing some of my artwork from my gallery because they contained nudity. After some soul searching, I asked myself why the **** should I have to censor my art?? Because someone might see a bare breast and become offended? If the administrators feel that some of my illustrations are offensive because they depict nudity and decide to remove them from my gallery they have the power to do that, but if that happens, I have the right to cancel my membership with this board.

Rsine.....I agree with you on the fact that nudity is in art ...I myself have no problem and have a breast showing in mine .. or well I did before I emptied my gallery by mistake ( dumb me lol ) I think its really the more offensive nudity that people might be having problems where more is showing then a simple breast or mound area ...I realize we have childeren here but tastful art is beautiful its the vulgarity that wont be tolerated .... does that make sense ?

Yes it does but how do you draw the line between what's tasteful and what's vulgar? What's tasteful for someone may seem vulgar to someone else.

I think maybe the Internet Police should be asked to leave. By that I refer to people who visit a website like this one who do not demonstrate an interest in learning to draw and have no galleries and post only to complain.

bob.

I agree. I look at it as spamming and should be treated as such. I remember seeing a painting done by the great Van Gough which depicted two people nude making love. Although it was fairly graphic, it's concidered a beautiful piece of art.

I don't understand why anyone would come to a website that was created for people who want to become artists but say they don’t want to see any nudity or show of affection in art.

I don’t know why anyone would say they want to be an artist but said, "I do not want to look at the nude figure or an artwork that depicts show of affection." This to me is the same as saying, "I want to be a doctor but I do not want to study the human anatomy and physiology."

As far back as you wish to go in the history of art you will find art depicting nudity and show of affection. The two are central elements of the art culture.

Even in religious art you will see Jesus Christ with only a small piece of cloth wrapped around his genitals.

And what about violence? Can you depict any thing more violent than torturing someone by beating them, putting a crown of thorns on their head and then driving nails in their hands and feet and then publicly displaying them nearly naked?

Many of the most famous paintings and statues are of nudes. I will only mention Boticello's birth of Venus and Michelangelo's David. Both are very beautiful works of art.

I also wish to touch briefly on the subject of nudity and underage children. Children are not born with an aversion or taboos toward nudity and show of affection. In fact most very young children enjoy being nude and they crave affection. They have to be taught to have an aversion to both. They have to be brain washed into believing these things are evil and that we must repress our natural inclinations we are born with.

Sure we must learn to discipline our desires, but forced total abstinence and repression is unhealthy.

Finally, your phobias and aversions are your problems don’t try to make them someone else's. Your perversions, and repressions are your problems; don’t try to make them everyone's.

If you do not have self-control and you get aroused when seeing a nude figure, then shame on you. If you tend to become violent when seeing art that depicts violence, then shame on you. That inclination toward violence is inside you already. Learn to control it, and if you can't do it on your own, get professional help.

Bob

P. S. I was inspired to post this because someone posted a reply to one of my figure drawings. If the moderators wish to remove a drawing that I post which they feel crosses the line then I will not complain. It's their decision. This post was referring to visitors who only want to complain but do not participate.

Great conversation!

I consider myself very open minded and am rarely offended by art. However, when I see a work that crosses the line, I immediately sense it, consciously evaluate the work, consider the reactions of others who may view it, and then decide if it should be deleted. Generally speaking, if the work is offensive to me, I delete it. Pornography should not be veiled under the umbrella of art. Art is art and porn is porn.

I taught drawing classes to individuals from 7 to adult for almost 20 years. I considered the human figure as simply something wonderful to draw. As I said to them many, many times, if an artist can draw the human figure well, he or she can draw anything.

Younger children simply accepted the body as something to draw. Adolescents had a sexually based curiosity about the adult male and female bodies, but none ever made an inappropriate remark in my class. I taught them to respect the human form as a thing of beauty. Adults simply became very focused on depicting the forms of the various anatomical structures and working on their technical skills.

Yet, there were unspoken boundaries within my class. They knew my philosophy well, and dared not take their art beyond a respect for the body as a drawing subject. Nobody ever rendered sexually explicit works; they all seemed to instinctively know the difference between art that was a wonderful depiction of human form, and works with nothing more than eroticism.

In all my years of teaching, I never received a negative comment from anyone, including parents, about my teaching life drawing to young people. I had a large library of art books depicting nudes available for them, and they were very well used as references for drawings. I also introduced them to various works by the masters, and many simply loved looking at the paintings.

In our new forum all drawings and paintings of nudes will be delegated to a specific section that will be clearly identified. This is not censorship, but merely a respect for cultural, experiential, and sensitivity-based differences within our art community. All people deserve a choice as to what they do or do not wish to view.

As a final remark, each of my wonderful moderators has extremely good instincts for telling the difference between art and pornography, and I trust their decisions completely.

Just my “2-sense” worth…

Brenda

Bob is right, because if any of us want to do a good drowing concerning the human body, we all should start by analaysing the nude. Without drowing the nude body of a human you can not know all the muscles and the mouvement of the body propertly.

P.S. escuse my spelling mistakes.